Speaker 1: 0:00

The following program. The ENT , mortgage and Realty Show is paid for in full by ENT mortgage, LLC and equal housing lender consumer access.org number 2 5 5 3 6 8. The advice and opinions expressed during the Academic Mortgage and Realty Show are solely that at the hosts and guests of ENT mortgage, LLC, and not WTMJ or Good Karma Brands.

Speaker 2: 0:20

Welcome to the Accu Net Mortgage and Realty Show, getting you inside information on buying, selling, and financing your home with expert advice from Accu Net Mortgage and Realty. And now, here's David Wicker and Tim Holdman .

Speaker 3: 0:33

Good morning and welcome to the Accu Mortgage and Realty Show. I'm David Wicker, loan Consultant and managing owner, where my individual NMLS ID number is 3 2 8 8 4 7. Here today with Mr. Tim Holdman, loan consultant and Mustachioed man himself, whose individual N ML S ID is 1 5 9 3 1 4 6. If you have a question or comment, you can call or text us on the WTMJ talk and text line, which is 8 5 5 6 1 6 1 6 20 . And of course, you can grab a podcast of today's show and past shows wherever you normally grab your podcasts. Well, Tim, it was an eventful week. Uh ,

Speaker 4: 1:11

It was indeed,

Speaker 3: 1:12

You know. So let's play , uh, headline , uh, speed dating. Sure. Uh, the presidential election was on Tuesday, Donald J. Trump, the President elect. Uh, we woke up then on Wednesday morning. That was the start of two days of the Federal Reserve meeting. Yep . And then on Thursday Chair Powell, along with members of the Federal Open Market Committee, announced at one o'clock Central Haa . We are cutting air quotes rates by a quarter.

Speaker 4: 1:47

Yes. A quarter percent. And

Speaker 3: 1:49

Then, and then Chair Powell had his normal press conference 30 minutes later where he ducked and weaved , uh, yes. Bypassed and threw

Speaker 4: 2:01

Questions. He said, he said words for 30 minutes. He

Speaker 3: 2:04

Said words. So I was looking at, so this is the second, let , let's summarize. Um, starting two years ago , uh, the Federal Reserve began to raise the Fed funds rate, which is the only rate that the Fed controls in order to increase the cost of borrowing so as to try to throttle inflation.

Speaker 4: 2:29

Yes .

Speaker 3: 2:30

Um, we have now come to the mountain, I guess we would describe it, where the Federal Reserves feels that while we've been standing on top of the high cost of interest rates for some time, and we've now, was it two months ago, the fed cut rates by half percent. Right.

Speaker 4: 2:52

Their first cut of the year. Yeah .

Speaker 3: 2:54

Again, rates, air quote rates. And now at this November meeting, they cut rates again. So, Tim, let me, I'm gonna phrase it to you this way, Tim, what was the question that you got about rates on , uh, Thursday at 1245? Yeah. And then, and then what was the answer you were giving at 1:05 PM about rates?

Speaker 4: 3:16

Yeah. Well, I mean, like you said, it was a , a very eventful week. Uh, people thought that rates, and I mean, when they're asking me about rates, they're talking about mortgage rates. Right. Because we are in the business of providing mortgages. Yes. Uh, so they said, oh, well, did, did mortgage rates change because of the outcome of the election? And oh, and then our rate's gonna change more because of the fed rate cut on Thursday. And it's funny, 'cause actually the, when the markets opened Wednesday , uh, the official announcement, mortgage rates actually got worse that day. Yeah . By a , not a huge margin, but a significant, you know, a significant enough to, to change everyone's rate sheets. Uh, and that was because the initial knee jerk reaction to the market is that the economy will actually , uh, potentially be stronger. And that is bad news for mortgage rates. Right. When the economy is projected to be stronger , uh, you know, investors shift their investing away from the low risk , uh, you know, long-term investments of mortgage-backed securities, and it did something more short term . So mortgage rates actually got a little bit worse due to the election results. And then , uh, on Thursday, they pretty much bounced back right. To where they were on, you know, Monday and Tuesday. Yeah,

Speaker 3: 4:27

I was, I was looking, if you just went into a coma on Tuesday, October 22nd Yeah . And woke up this past Friday, you'd be in the exact same place.

Speaker 4: 4:37

Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 3: 4:39

But, but you know what, gyrations is what makes the world, I guess, a little bit more interesting. Yeah. How many of our clients turned around and said, movement this rates that I've decided to, you know, call off the home shopping experience Zero. Although I think, as I said, as I said to dad last week, I am now, it hasn't happened yet, but I'm waiting for the first client to change the reason why they're waiting to buy the house. It was Tuesday's election. Now

Speaker 4: 5:08

There's , now that's just gonna be something else. Christmas. Oh, Thanksgiving . Thanksgiving is, you know , two weeks away. I got family. I'm already, I'm already brining the Turkey that I'm going to, you know , I

Speaker 3: 5:17

Couldn't move.

Speaker 4: 5:18

Yeah. I gotta get wood chips for the smoker, you know, and, and get , get it up to temperature for smoking my Turkey. And then it's gonna be Christmas, and then it's gonna be New Year. And then, you know, in the meantime, we've got customers, the , the serious ones who are, they decided they want to own a home Yes. For real life reasons. And they're out there shopping and, and doing it. So, like we've said a million times, you know, we're happy to give the insider knowledge on rate movement, a mortgage rate movement. Let's just, let's , uh, resolve David, that when we talk about rates, we always put the word mortgage in front of it. Yes. True . Uh , so what , we're happy to talk about mortgage rates, but that is not the reason that most people are going to choose to or not to buy a home either this year or anytime in 2025.

Speaker 3: 6:01

So , uh, on that note, and after this first break, I would like to talk about October home sales, because guess what, people got out there and did the thing. And so let's try to measure how people are getting to the closing table. Uh, we'll cover that after this break. You are listening to the Acuate Mortgage and Realty Show on AM six 20 WTMJ

Speaker 2: 6:23

Home buying advice from the guys who know it best. This is the Acuate Mortgage and Realty Show with Brian Wicker on WTMJ. Welcome

Speaker 3: 6:31

Back to the Anette Mortgage and Realty Show. I'm David, that's Tim over there. Uh , Tim, if segment one was Headline World, then let us turn then to, I guess, another headline, but , uh, aged , uh, headline, but , uh, important October Home Sales Sure. And New Listings, because ultimately, although my do headlines impact what is happening on the ground? Come to your own conclusions on that one, sort

Speaker 4: 7:01

Of, yeah.

Speaker 3: 7:02

Okay. But, so this data is from the multiple Listing service, which means that these home sales were handled by a member of the National Association of Realtors. That means that for sale by owner transactions are not included. Um , and these are for single family detached homes and condominiums in the five county Milwaukee metro area. I was reminded on election night , uh, if you're a cool kid, you say Milwaukee, and then the WOW Counties, Waukesha, Ozaki and Washington. Wow. And then Racine County , uh, to the south. Those are the, those are the five counties. Okay. So , uh, the number of new listings, new fresh meat was up by 8% compared to October of 2023. That means that 1,980 new listings, new scroll late at night, seeing what hit the market 1980, came on the market, which is 145 more available, you know, scrollable, swipeable homes to look at than October a year ago. Closed sales in October of 2024 were up about the same , um, excuse me. Were about the same at about 1% or 17 fewer actual closed homes in October of this year, compared to October of 2023. So flat. Yeah . That number was 1,521. Condos and single family Homes changed hands with the help of a realtor. Yeah.

Speaker 4: 8:32

Which I just wanna point out that this does not include any for sale by owner. Right. Again, transactions. So if you just used a real estate attorney to draft up a contract and sold a home to a friend or a relative or something like that, that is not part of this data. And I think, you know, it's important to , at least from my own experience, David, over the last year, I've definitely seen an uptick personally in those for sale by owner transactions. So I , I would agree with that. I would add a couple percentage points to all this data of October of 2024 compared to October, 2023 specifically, you know, due to the , uh, the FSBO occurrence as we call it.

Speaker 3: 9:10

But, but even as, as we say, week to week , month to month, it's like, yeah, we just said that. Oh man. New listings 1,980. But when you're looking for a house, you're actually not looking at all nearly 2000 of those listings. You're like , oh, I wanna buy , um, a 1955 ranch in Brookfield. Oh, how many of those came on the market? Like one

Speaker 4: 9:34

And a half with , with , with at least two full baths and at least three bedrooms and square footage of this. And I want it to be between, you know, Lily and , uh, <laugh> , you know , uh, between Lily and Pilgrim. Thank , it's like , all right . Yeah. You know, it , to your point, the inventory shortage is much more specific and concentrated Yes . Than this wide market data, you know?

Speaker 3: 9:58

So , uh, you'll, you'll like this one, the , hold on, hold on to your, you know , anyone who is expecting the air to come out of home values is about to be sorely disappointed. Yeah. Median sales price for October, 2024 was $340,000. Tim ,

Speaker 4: 10:19

Which was <laugh>. Yeah . Yeah .

Speaker 3: 10:21

Do you wanna guess how many dollars that was higher than October of 2023?

Speaker 4: 10:27

Uh , I'm gonna cheat 'cause I have the same data that Okay , you have, it's $35,000 higher than October of 2023, which is by a percentage point a an 11% increase. Right . So for the people who were thinking, oh man, these home values are gonna come down, I'm gonna wait until I'm gonna wait. Home value . Yeah. Home values come down. That ain't happening. And in fact, you know, a lot of , uh, economic experts are predicting that when interest rates do fall a little bit, that will actually spur home values and purchase price amounts to be even higher than they are now. So the people that are waiting for home values to drop are gonna be waiting even longer than the people that are waiting for rates to drop. I think

Speaker 3: 11:08

Ultimately, you know, 'cause you and I are connecting with active home buyers, it's like I wanna the, the people , um, and you only know what, you know, just to quote my ancestors. And so I wanna like, introduce the new people we're gonna talk to here in fall of 2024. Yeah . I wanna introduce those people to the people from fall of 2023 who said the same words. Yeah. To be like, I'd like, I'd like to show you what one year of waiting looks like in terms of payment appreciation.

Speaker 4: 11:40

Yeah . And we can do that math. Yeah. We can show you. It's like it , you know, a purchase price equates to a monthly payment. That's really what matters, right? Yes . And it's like if you paid 35 grand more, and, you know, it depends on down payment amount, obviously, but , uh, newsflash that leads to a higher monthly payment. Yes. Even if rates are flat or slightly improved, right? Yes. Right.

Speaker 3: 12:00

Alright , uh, there a couple , a little bit more meat on the bone on, on some of this data about October, and then of course, how that then translates to some of the real life stories that we're gonna share before we all call it quits here , uh, on our Accu Mortgage and Realty Show. Stick around. We've got more. You've been listening on. AM six 20 WTMJ getting

Speaker 2: 12:18

You into the home of your dreams. Here's more of the Accu Mortgage and Realty Show with Brian Weer on WTMJ.

Speaker 3: 12:25

Welcome back to the Accu Mortgage and Realty Show. Um , Tim, we're unpacking this data from October for, you know, hey, what did people actually go do? Yeah . When it came to what did it take to win and what kind of appetite was there out in the market to get to the closing table? So one data point we've been tracking for a long time is how many of the closed , uh, transactions had to pay a price that was above what the home was originally listed at. So when we look at single family homes and condos, the answer to that in October was 43% of those properties sold above the initial list price. Month over , well, year over year. That's actually down a little bit from October of 2023. October ,

Speaker 4: 13:16

But not by March .

Speaker 3: 13:17

No, it was 48% last year. It's 43%. Now, does that mean that we're getting seasonal cooling ahead of time? Maybe. Um, the other, the even frothier part of the market, the share of properties that sold not just a dollar over the list price, but $10,000 or more over the list price was 23%, which compared to October of last year was down 4%. I'm gonna, I'm gonna call that a wash. Uh, yeah. Year over year. Um, but you know, that, let's pivot then about, you know, the hunger of what did it take to win. 'cause the other interesting data point was that cash buyers, and maybe we should, we should paraphrase it. Cash buyers is when I wrote the contract, I said, I didn't need , uh, yeah . Financing to get to the closing table.

Speaker 4: 14:11

Let's call them cash offers, not cash buyers. Right.

Speaker 3: 14:14

They , Ooh , nice. Okay. So that percentage was 24%, or basically a quarter of everybody who got to the closing table in October wrote a cash offer. Wow. Yeah. Uh ,

Speaker 4: 14:28

And , and , and that's the slam dunk, right? I mean, as a seller, that's the best offer because that buyer's saying, I'm, I don't even need a mortgage to buy your property. I I'm probably gonna get one. I I, we don't have this data, but I would venture a a guess that the majority of those cash offers still got some flavor of financing. Yeah. Because the smart, you know , uh, way is not to liquidate all those assets, even if you have them, it's to borrow and then keep your money working for you . Right. Which I think is what a lot of people choose to do.

Speaker 3: 15:01

And I, I would say that the , you know, this quarter of cash is proof. I think we all maybe knew this implicitly, but it was like, Hey, you know what works being strong Yeah . Uh , to get a seller to say Yes. The, the other interesting nugget that, and I want to then turn this over to a , a story of a client that I started working with this past week was , uh, a profile about first time home buyers and the sellers who are selling to those home buyers . Yeah . Uh , the National Association of Realtors released this week a study talking about home sales from July of 23 to June of 24. The median age of sellers was 63 years old. Oof . And is the highest ever recorded? To which I'm like, duh.

Speaker 4: 15:54

Yeah. It makes sense. It it does. Yeah. They're, they're the probably the least rate sensitive , uh, age demographic. Right. You know , it's like their most 63 year olds, their financial cake is baked, you know, for their, for their life. Right. And they're probably the most , um, able to move around where they're not maybe handcuffed to a particular mortgage rate. They may not be happy about it.

Speaker 3: 16:20

I'm gonna , let me, I'm gonna say it. Um , the David way, they've had so much appreciation that when that 63-year-old median seller sells, they're gonna walk away with cash of which they're paying the best kind of interest rate, which is zero. Zero.

Speaker 4: 16:35

Yeah. The , uh,

Speaker 3: 16:36

And so they're not, to your point, they're not beholden necessarily to , or they're not handcuffed as some other sellers. How's about David? Sure . Like , or Tim? Yeah . The rate that is on either or each of our houses is like, I'm not giving that up.

Speaker 4: 16:52

Yeah. And we, we each bought our home a handful of years ago. Yeah . So, you know, we have some good equity, but we all, we still have a , uh, we'll call it a healthy mortgage balance on those properties, you know, versus like, I'm sure you've seen the, the , the fun memes , uh, floating around TikTok and stuff where they, you know, show an , an old , uh, baby boomer dancing to some hokey sonnets . I do . It's like when they bought their home in 1980 for, you know, a pack of gum and now it's worth, you know, a million dollars and they're selling it, you know, and it's,

Speaker 3: 17:20

I'm cool enough that I have seen that. Yeah.

Speaker 4: 17:22

It's facetious, but it, it rings true. It's like that, that makes sense that the data shows that the average age of a seller in over the past year was the highest it's ever been.

Speaker 3: 17:32

So this kind of takes me into , um, a , a client story who I connected with this past week because, and even as you alluded to earlier in the show, those private transactions, hey, that 63-year-old seller, median average trying to sell to junior in a, without going on the market necessarily. Yeah. And , and I wanna just talk ba talk through the subspecialty that we've developed as a company and as individual Mortgage Pros around this private , um, way to buy and sell a house. So let's get into some of that. And I know you've got a story to share as well, but now it's time to turn it over to the WTMJ Breaking News Center.

Speaker 2: 18:14

Don't break the fact to get into a house. Back to the ACU Net Mortgage and Realty Show with Brian Wicker on WTMJ.

Speaker 3: 18:21

Thanks for hanging out with us. I'm David, that's Tim over there. Hello. Um , Tim, the data that we were just referencing were home sales purchases , uh, facilitated by a member of the National Association of Realtors. We get calls what feels like all the time, all the

Speaker 4: 18:41

Time

Speaker 3: 18:42

On the subspecialty, the nearly invisible part of the market where it's family or really good friends, but mostly family trying to transact , uh, the purchase or sale of a home between other family members. Yep . And that data was not in what we talked about in the front half of the show. Yeah . But requires a level of care that, I don't know if it's more than what your regular home buying or home selling. I think it's just different.

Speaker 4: 19:15

Yeah. It's different. 'cause I mean, there's no realtors involved in that transaction. Right .

Speaker 3: 19:21

And there , there can be by the way, that's

Speaker 4: 19:23

Not, there can be, but I'd say there's typically not. Yeah. Uh, at least not directly. Right. Because they're , one of the main points of a family purchase or to use a mortgage jargon and a non arm's length transaction is that they don't need to go find a buyer. They , they have , they

Speaker 3: 19:40

Got a seller,

Speaker 4: 19:41

Got a buyer, and typically the , the , the agreement of the purchase price and the details of the contract is already scribbled on some coffee stained and applicants somewhere anyways. Or a verbal agreement. So it's about making it official and there's no, you know , uh, the realtors aren't gonna earn a commission on that and the seller doesn't want to pay a large commission to a realtor for a deal that's pretty much already kind of Yeah . Agreed upon . Right.

Speaker 3: 20:03

So I , um, got connected with a new client from their financial advisor, and they , uh, in their case, they are , uh, uh, purchasing the property of their , um, deceased spouse Okay . From a second marriage.

Speaker 4: 20:24

Got

Speaker 3: 20:25

It. And so a lot of times, I I should say, when we facilitate things like buying from an estate, a lot of times you, we reach for something called gift of equity. If that's something that the seller, you know, they don't need to walk away with every nickel. They can , uh, forego some of what the proceeds might have been and gift that equity. So it's almost like a, it's like a, not a silent down payment, but a backdoor down payment. I'll,

Speaker 4: 20:53

I'll even go. So you're leaving

Speaker 3: 20:54

The equity there.

Speaker 4: 20:55

Yeah. I'll even go one step further. It's like, usually they want to cut some type of deal to the buyer or the property. Grandma's

Speaker 3: 21:02

Not trying to soak grandson for, you know. Yeah.

Speaker 4: 21:05

And , and usually they logically the , they think that the way to do that is to actually discount the purchase price or the sale price of the property. And that's actually not the smartest way to do it. The smartest way is to set the price of the property at whatever the current market value is, but then do a gift of equity for the difference. 'cause that way the buyer in the eyes of the mortgage world, and typically they need a mortgage, they're coming in with a much stronger equity position. And that gift of equity can pay for literally anything down payment, closing costs , prepaid expenses, or, you know, combination of all three of those things.

Speaker 3: 21:37

So my client actually wasn't gonna get any of that. No gift of equity . Okay . They're literally writing a check well, for their down payment, and we're lending them some amount of money because the heirs of this property, they're, I , I don't think it was adversarial, but I don't think there was a discount to be had . Sure . They're ,

Speaker 4: 21:57

They're looking for some cash , uh, right . To, to walk away with. Yeah.

Speaker 3: 22:00

They named a price. They , um, and my client is making a substantial , uh, over 50% down payment on this home. Okay. So it was just interesting to talk through the, in a private negotiation, what are the things that you care about? Do you care? Like if you agree on a price, do you care to have an appraisal contingency? I don't think so. Yeah . Um , ultimately, because perhaps with family or near family, I don't know if you'd be engendering goodwill if you came back to be like, see the appraisal came in low. Let's, let's drop our price. I think the price is gonna be the price

Speaker 4: 22:43

In our family deal. And in their case with a 50% down payment, the, on our side, the appraisal could even come back a little bit less than the purchase price and it wouldn't affect the mortgage financing at all .

Speaker 3: 22:54

A hundred percent. And it's just, you know, I think , uh, clients and our listeners will bring what they think the steps are, you know , in the process to the conversations that we and any of the AED loan consultants have. And ultimately, it's like, you can write your contract however you want, but lemme just tell you, you know, in this kind of unique setup, you don't have to Yeah . Particularly if it's not gonna be important to you in order to get to the closing table. Yeah .

Speaker 4: 23:25

There's a lot less protections you really need in most cases, or a lot less , uh, of the traditional contingencies that you would put if you were buying from a stranger. Agreed. In most cases. Yeah.

Speaker 3: 23:36

The, the other thing that I'll just note is it could be that in a non arms length transaction, underwriting sometimes can say, Hey, you know how you got one appraisal? Yeah . We'd like two appraisals because Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> , you're a little too close 'cause you know each other. Yeah. Uh, and that and that second, you know, belt and suspenders on value, whether, I would hope the ACNA team could help out on that. But anybody who is considering a family, I know this person, you know, home sale transaction. Be mindful that you might get the double dip on the cost of making sure the home really is worth what it's worth. Alright . Uh, that's my story. Tim, I want to get into your story after we come back from this break. Your listening to the NT Mortgage and Realty Show on AM six 20 WTMJ.

Speaker 2: 24:24

Important home buying questions and answers you can count on. This is the Acuate Mortgage and Realty Show with Brian Wicker on WTMJ.

Speaker 4: 24:33

Welcome back to the Acuate Mortgage and Realty Show. I'm Tim, senior loan consultant at ACU net , joined by David, my brother-in-law and boss and , uh, brother in arms , so to speak. Uh, David, I wanted to share a story. We're gonna just turn the boat a little bit , uh, to a different topic here. Um, for I , this segment is for all the home shoppers out there that may have been looking for a while and our discouraged, right. Because regardless of rates and all the different statistics we talked about with home values and prices, I still think the biggest challenge in this market is with inventory. Yes. Because, you know, like we mentioned already, you're not looking at all the listings, you're looking at a very small slice of that pie. 'cause you want to buy in a different area in a different school district. And then even from that, you want a property with certain characteristics like square footage, number of beds, number of baths, right? Yes . Yeah . So I have a customer , uh, referred from her realtor. I think we connected two, maybe two and a half years ago. <laugh> . Oh my God . Okay. Yeah . Single mom, you know, single mom , uh, a few kids and, you know, looking in a very specific area both for work reasons and school reasons and, you know, single income household, right. The, the price point that she was searching in further limited the, the, you know, the, the number of houses or , or condos that she could look at. Right? Yeah . So, you know, we got her pre-approved. We did the consultation on, Hey, this is what your monthly payment would be for this price point. She had a very , uh, clear monthly payment goal in mind, which I think is very helpful. Right? So if you , if you're a first time home buyer or any home buyer for that matter, calling into acuate , one of the things that I think any of our consultants will ask you is, what is your goal for the monthly payment? Because then we can help you figure out what price range to be shopping in, because what you qualify for and what you should actually try to afford are usually very two different price points. And , and

Speaker 3: 26:29

How , uh, how , uh, stubborn are you about what that payment might be? Well ,

Speaker 4: 26:33

Exactly. And, and the monthly payment goal can change, and it probably will as, as you begin your search a little bit. But at least it's good to go in with a certain goal in mind. Like, I want my mortgage payment to be X or between this range, right? Yeah . Yeah. So went through all that, went through the exercise of, you know, different things to write a winning offer, and that was all great, but she just wasn't finding anything or, you know, I would check in with her and she'd be like, yeah, I saw something. And then I, you know, literally two hours later it was under contract and, you know, that that journey went on for quite some time. And finally this past week she saw a condo that popped up on the market. Yeah. Went , went and saw it that day and said, Tim, this is the one I would like to make an offer. We ahead of her even writing the contract, we, we looked at monthly payment numbers and she said, yes, I can make this work if I offer this price. I said, okay, let , let , let's, let's shoot our shot and see what happens. Yeah. She , uh, she wrote, I think just modestly above the listing price, so not egregiously, but I think just maybe a couple thousand over. And , um, the tip

Speaker 3: 27:35

Of the cap to the seller be like, monthly

Speaker 4: 27:37

Home. Yeah. Just like, I I want to give you what you want , uh, but I'm not willing to break the break the bank. Yeah. And the seller said, you know what, boom, we got, we got what we wanted. It was , she was the first in with her offer, and the seller said, yes, I how that we , we will sell to you. Wow. And she, and she's over the moon and, you know, it now begins the process of the loan approval. But I , you know, I believe that's gonna go very smoothly for her. And , um, I just, you know, this is a word of encouragement to the people out there that it might be a slow burn, and that's okay. You know, if you're , uh, comfortable where you're living and you have a lease, or you're living rent free with relatives while you're saving up money or whatever the case may be, don't give up. Right. Yeah. Because it , it is, it is going to happen for you eventually. The only rea the only way it won't happen eventually is if you just stop.

Speaker 3: 28:26

If you stop, then it stops. Yeah.

Speaker 4: 28:28

Yeah, yeah . So, you know, it's all about your desire for how much you want to own versus the, the agony and the, the low level stress, the grind that comes The grind. Yeah. The grind of just, you know, continuing to look and go to showings and maybe make a couple offers, you know, all those things.

Speaker 3: 28:45

The , um, what I'll be curious about is if something, let's just pretend that , oh , there's something with the basement <laugh> . Sure . And I know this is a condo, but, you know, money fixes everything. And so I'm just always curious then, you know, once you get the fish on the line

Speaker 4: 29:05

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 29:06

Are , are buyers willing to get back out there to break up with that house and be like, you know what, I'll find someone else to fall in love with when the journey to just fall in love in the first place took

Speaker 4: 29:16

So long plus , yeah. I think a lot of it depends on how long it took them to get to that first one. I have , I have some other borrowers, it's a completely different scenario, but pre-approved 'em two months ago they got an accepted offer, I think within the first couple weeks of me pre-approving them. That house did have a bad basement. Oh . They , they walked away. And before the realtor could even email me the mutual release and cancellation agreement of that first contract, they got an accepted offer on a different property. Oh , okay. And that one's moving forward and, and everything is fine with it, so it's apples and oranges. Right. They tho those folks were looking at a completely different county, different price range. Oh my gosh . Single family . I mean, again, not even comparable to my first customer. Right. But it is, you know , it's a case by case basis, I think always.

Speaker 3: 29:59

Alright . Uh , I pre that was great. Uh, when we come back, I wanna talk about some of the statistics that have recently been released. We kind of tipped our cap to this data earlier in the show, comparing first time home buyers here in 2024 compared to years prior, and some of the differences between some of the heavy hitters in the, some mortgage space on what the data's actually saying. We'll cover that in our last segment. You're listening to the Acuate Mortgage and Realty Show on AM six 20 WTMJ.

Speaker 2: 30:24

Find a place to call Home without the headache. This is the Acuate Mortgage and Realty Show with Brian Wicker on WTMJ.

Speaker 3: 30:32

Thanks for hanging with us here this Sunday morning on the ANet Mortgage and Realty Show. Uh, Tim, tomorrow's Veteran's Day , uh, or Armistice Day. I think depending on how long you've been , um, <laugh> being, how long you've been mindful of Veteran's Day are many thanks to the men and women of our armed services who benefit from , uh, uh, things like VA loans, which are awesome , uh, when we can reach for that tool in our toolkit and well deserved. Yeah . Um, there in the last week or two have been two contradictory reports about home buyers and sellers. One was from the National Association of Realtors and the other one was from Freddie Mac. Yeah.

Speaker 4: 31:18

So both reputable big Yeah . Two heavyweights. Yeah, exactly. Yeah .

Speaker 3: 31:22

Uh , not, yeah, not , not rookies in this total mortgage thing. And the data are , let's just talk first about first time home buyers . The National Association of Realtors reported that of everyone that they looked at from July of 23 through June of 24, 20 4% of buyers were first time buyers. Notably, that was an all time low in comparison to previous analysis and down significantly down a chunk. Yeah. From the, the previous year, which was 32% of buyers were first time home buyers. That is notably , um, at odds

Speaker 4: 32:05

<laugh>

Speaker 3: 32:05

With what Freddie Mac then said about, I mean, Freddie Mac is buying the mortgages, you know, the National Association of Realtors is transacting, you know, coordinating. Right . Freddie Mac is eating

Speaker 4: 32:18

Mortgages. They're lend they're lending the money. Yeah. Yeah . They're bringing the money to the table.

Speaker 3: 32:21

Freddie Mac says, oh, no, no. 53% of the people we looked at we're first time home buyers .

Speaker 4: 32:29

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 32:30

This , uh, if, if we wanted to be, you know, statistical nerds, you know, one element is Freddy is only measuring the people who borrowed money.

Speaker 4: 32:40

Right.

Speaker 3: 32:40

And, and it is invisible to people who might have just written a check or, or , or found other means to borrow funds. Mm-Hmm . <affirmative> , maybe they borrowed it against a portfolio, maybe they borrowed it against the cash value of life insurance. Maybe gift a little bit of that, a little bit of this. So, you know, like all statistics, 60% of statistics are made up and you just gotta be careful about how they're measuring and what they're measuring.

Speaker 4: 33:07

I think the true number is probably somewhere in the middle between those two. Uh , absolutely. Uh , uh, ranges. But another detail I thought of is that what does the NAR define? Like, what's their definition of a first time home buyer ? Right. Because with Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae, you are considered to be a first time home buyer as long as you haven't owned any real estate within the last three calendar years. Yeah . Uh, so ironically, you know, if I had sold a house four years ago and rented, and then I'm looking to buy again, I'm considered technically in, in the eyes of Freddie Mac, a first time home buyer . Whereas I don't know if the National Association of Realtors would carry that same distinction with that same definition. Right. So it's a pretty wide discrepancy, I think for that to be the only reason. Yeah . Take , take the average. But it , it could be a somewhere I , and I think just boots on the ground perspective, I mean, for sure I talk to more first time or potential first time home buyers as, as inquiries or customers than I do repeat home buyers . Again, it's not, it's not 80 20 or 70 30, but I, you know, I think personally 'cause the , the average age of first time home buyers is also going up Right. As millennials are finally entering the market because they're financially at a place where they can afford to buy a home. Uh ,

Speaker 3: 34:22

According to the National Association of Realtors, the median age of buyers who were first time buyers was 38 years old, which I'm glad that I'm still below that number.

Speaker 4: 34:34

Barely. Yeah .

Speaker 3: 34:36

Ouch. But it's, it's , um, just the other, before we run out of time, the other element that I , uh, saw in this report is that buyers spent a median of 10 weeks searching for a home during the time that the NAR was looking at. Right. Okay. Call that two and a half months. It's like, as I've begun to say, home buyers note, oh, home values are expensive. dot.do in the neighborhood that I would like to live in. Yeah. There is a home available to you somewhere. You somewhere with what you want. It's just the , the, we need to be good about saying, well , where Yeah . Is is that home higher?

Speaker 4: 35:21

Yeah. You said money fixes everything earlier in the show, David. Yeah, I would counter Location is the one thing that money cannot fix. Whoa. You know , everything else you can change about the house except literally where it sits. Yeah . Unless you buy an rv,

Speaker 3: 35:37

<laugh> not yet in the toolkit at ANet Mortgage, but who knows what 2025 will bring. That's all the time that we have for today's show. I'm David, that's Tim. If you need a pro on your team to get you to the closing table for your new house, all you have to do is click on the blue button@accunet.com. A-C-C-U-N-E t.com . You've been listening to the Acuate Mortgage and Realty Show on AM six 20 WTMJ.

Speaker 1: 36:04

The proceeding was a paid program. Advice and opinions expressed during the Accu Net Mortgage and Realty Show are solely that of the host or guests of Acuate Mortgage and Acuate Realty Advisors and not WTMJ Radio or Good Karma Brands. Milwaukee, LLC.